Rental Guns

[Sarge]

Basically ever since Darrin posted that article about paintball where they talked about not just using rentals that worked, but using ones that could keep up, I've been thinking about it. You could change what rentals are used for open play so that newbies didn't have below average guns against veterans with high end guns. Now I know that's not normally the case in private parties, but at open play at the different fields I've been to, I've always seen that being the case. So I really want to know, what would you use as rentals? (within pricing reason) If you have another idea post it, but which of these would you find suitable for newbies at open play.
Tippman 98 custom E grip - Tippmann Triumph loader - 3000 psi tank
Smart Parts Vibe - Viewloader Revolution - 3000 psi tank
Smart Parts SP1 - Viewloader Revolution - 3000 psi tank
Spyder VS2 - Viewloader Revolution - 3000 psi tank
Those are just four ideas I came up with, all guns can easily reach around 10 bps
So basically which do you think would work best? If you have any other ideas go ahead and post them. :fighting0011:
(If someone could help me make a poll, pm me how)

[Mustangman]

another viable option is the SP-1. it's a reliable simple marker that can be enough to compete in most woodsball type games.

[TeaBuffalo]

Of the guns listed, I would say Vibe.

Of guns not listed, I would have to say A5 w/response trigger.

No batteries to mess with. Super easy tech work that everyone already knows how to do. Tippmann has some pretty good specials on RT A5's once in a while.

[Sarge]

another viable option is the SP-1. it's a reliable simple marker that can be enough to compete in most woodsball type games.

lol check the list again.

Of the guns listed, I would say Vibe.

Of guns not listed, I would have to say A5 w/response trigger.

No batteries to mess with. Super easy tech work that everyone already knows how to do. Tippmann has some pretty good specials on RT A5's once in a while.

Didn't think of that. The whole no battery thing would be nice.

[Mustangman]

must have read it to fast.:rolleyes: DOH!

[badmoon]

lol wow you do know what your saying right. alot of money spent on ds end at one. not very often do you see an oppertunity to even have that much to spend. it would be thousends of dollers. and if you dint notice we do have some a-5s for rent and an x-7. and at the point of an etrigger thous arnet alowed on any way so it doesnt matter. big days ya but still.

[EZD]

I think everyone is missing the big picture!!

NEW PLAYERS are the most important thing for paintball.

It is now known that high-end guns and fast rates of fire have stopped the grown of paintball.

Millions of people are trying it and getting over shot and not liking the game and never coming back and telling their friends how bad it is. (especially speedball but more and more with woodsball)

Rental guns need to be reliable work horses. Fast shooting guns will just turn more players off the game. I have been playing paintball for 23 years and have seen this problem from the beginning.

Once players have fun and get hooked like 99% of us will go and buy a better gun.

We all need to help bring and help keep new players liking the game of paintball or will have no one to play against one day.

Darrin

P.S. The poll should be why do so many sub par players think a fast speedball like gun will make them a better player. :)

[Thalion]

I don't think a gun that can "keep up" will help the new players renting any more than a 98 will.

Why? The new player is just that, new. They lack the skills that make the "better" gear beneficial.

[Ish]

I think everyone is missing the big picture!!

NEW PLAYERS are the most important thing for paintball.

It is now known that high-end guns and fast rates of fire have stopped the grown of paintball.

Millions of people are trying it and getting over shot and not liking the game and never coming back and telling their friends how bad it is. (especially speedball but more and more with woodsball)

Rental guns need to be reliable work horses. Fast shooting guns will just turn more players off the game. I have been playing paintball for 23 years and have seen this problem from the beginning.

Once players have fun and get hooked like 99% of us will go and buy a better gun.

We all need to help bring and help keep new players liking the game of paintball or will have no one to play against one day.

Darrin

P.S. The poll should be why do so many sub par players think a fast speedball like gun will make them a better player. :)


agreed.

I don't think ramping up a noobs/newplayers shooting capability is a good idea, if anything it will cause more over shootings and might scare some people from coming back.
right now i'm helping a person around rochester that is looking at starting up a field down here.what we have been pushing around for rentals is putting a little flash on them ( 98's with ak/m16 kits) milsim is very big atm if you let someone play with a marker that looks the way they want to play ( swat/ weekend warrior or what ever you want to call it) it will give them a bost to thier ego witch will make them less afraid of the high tec markers..will they shoot any better? maybe.. but the mind set of the player will get them more involed in the game. i'm sure you all have seen it at the big games when your walking out on the field a lot of new players will be intimadated by the look of ppls milsims.. i say give the new players a little boost and let them have markers that look the look for the game ( senarios)

[TeaBuffalo]

I think one of the bigger problems with overshooting is that people are getting shot with rock-like paintballs like Hot Spots and Monster Balls. The bigger problem is that there are players out there that buy that paint on purpose specifically BECAUSE they know it is hard and it hurts. The problem isn't fast guns, it's bad attitudes.

Good paint doesn't hurt unless you are close. I typically shoot X-ball Gold or Rec-Sport and I have drilled people 3-5 times and they don't complain a bit. They even comment that it didn't even hurt. Good paint flies straighter, leaves a much better mark, and doesn't sting like a lot of **** out there.

I think it is very unfair to single out a certain style of marker when it is clearly a certain style of player that gives the game a bad name.


** I can't believe that word is censored.

[EZD]

Splat Tag will be lowering our RULES of Rate Of Fire to 10bps for all electronic guns.

[Bizzare87]

In all honesty I don't believe fields consider the renters playing experience too terribly much when choosing there rentals. The main consideration are most likely reliability and repair cost. Thats why we see so many Tippmann markers as rentals. I would agree that the SP-1 would make a good advanced rental. Offer two types of guns a 98 custom and an SP-1 for like 5-10 bucks more.

[Sarge]

In all honesty I don't believe fields consider the renters playing experience too terribly much when choosing there rentals. The main consideration are most likely reliability and repair cost. Thats why we see so many Tippmann markers as rentals. I would agree that the SP-1 would make a good advanced rental. Offer two types of guns a 98 custom and an SP-1 for like 5-10 bucks more.

That's what I'd do to. They got 98s, sp1s, and 09 egos at air assault.

[JJohnson]

That's what I'd do to. They got 98s, sp1s, and 09 egos at air assault.

09 Egos for rent? Bet those cost an arm and a leg. You probably have to hand over your wallet and car keys if you rent one:D

[Sarge]

09 Egos for rent? Bet those cost an arm and a leg. You probably have to hand over your wallet and car keys if you rent one:D

lol close, just 45.00. The sp1s are just like 10 extra.

[EZD]

I lot of fields Rent High End Guns, it helps to get players to buy similar guns and shoot more paintballs.

[CrazyDave]

Heeeey D, Why not rent SL-68 IIs or Trracers? I dont think i have ever met a player that has ever been turned off of the sport after playing with a pump. In fact, I think the thrill of the hunt and the glory of the kill has hardened their love of paintball even more after making almost impossible shots on players with thousands in gear. Personally, I love that look of "WTF? did I just get hit buy a PUMP?" in their eyes as they walk off the field swearing and in shame. As an added bonus they stay longer than the high bps players and always tell their friends ;)

Think about it,
- 50-60 new(ish), even less used
- Massive replay factor
- Easy the maintain, They have 5 parts tongue:)
- Runs on any air source without problems
- Raises player moral

I think that its worth a look at the very least, but I would like to think that it would be an awesome starting point for recruiting fresh players to the game.

[TeaBuffalo]

I think new players would HATE pumps. Look how many people immediately assume that if they get out they need a better gun. I think experienced players have loved the switch to pump, newbies are all about having the best, fastest, furthest shooting, most powerful gun they can get their hands on. I work at a store and I can't tell you how many times I've been asked "which one is the strongest" or "Which one is the most powerful".

You really think that many people hang their head in shame because they got hit by a pump..? I can't see any experienced player getting worked up because a certain type of marker hit them. Hell, I was surrendered once, and that didn't even bother me. I was much more impressed than I was pissed. I congratulated the guy and moved on.

[badmoon]

ya but it might also alow for more pump only open plays. just a thought.

[JJohnson]

I lot of fields Rent High End Guns, it helps to get players to buy similar guns and shoot more paintballs.

Yeah, but 09' Egos?? I mean, they have only been out for a few months. I can see them renting high end guns, but I just didn't think they would be that new of high end guns.

[TeaBuffalo]

Yeah, but 09' Egos?? I mean, they have only been out for a few months. I can see them renting high end guns, but I just didn't think they would be that new of high end guns.

When I was there this year they weren't renting 09's, they were renting 08's.

[CrazyDave]

Well.... I thought it was a good pitch at least tongue:) But I honestly think that adding pumps for the rental players would add a more diverse experience for the folks that rent markers. Besides, if they don't like it they always have the option to upgrade to a faster more paint/air intensive marker for a couple extra bucks.

ya but it might also alow for more pump only open plays. just a thought.

I also agree with Nate. Even if we do not see more pump only days, D can give other regular players the option to play in the pump only games and it will make it a less exclusive group.

[Alphawolf]

On the topic of new players that come out we look at it this way. They're not "fresh meat" but a "fresh face" that may bring more people into this sport that is dwindling. Now more than ever paintball needs new players to keep your local fields going in this economic downfall. So I say instead of making that noob your primary target it might be benificial to take then under your wing, even for just the day at the field and give them some pointers and some good feedback.

[C4 Explosives]

I agree about higher end, higher ROF markers more likely being used by newbies who don't fully understand the game to overshoot.

My main marker is a Tippmann Carbine, 68 or Pro, they're both tough and easy to maintain. They're also wickedly accruate and quiet with the right barrel, which, I might add shares threads with the A5, so you can get a tough old marker with a modern barrel and air system and go to town. Red dot sight is actually useful.

Most of the rental markers i've seen used at fields are Tippy 68's, Pros, or 98's. What I never understood was why field owners never put better barrels on them. It's one of the cheaper upgrades, but probably has the highest cost vs. benefit payback. I don't think that 12bps vs. 4-8bps is that big of a disadvantage to offer high-end markers to newbies, from the field owner perspective i can see where this would bring more $$ and they'd blow more paint, but you have to look at maintenance costs and the life of the marker. Will those 08 egos still be up and running as rentals in 12-15 years with the same amount of maintenance that tippy's need, I kind of doubt it.

[oncenothing77]

one thing i think would help with new players is in open games, granted you have enough players, to separate people for the first few games, into kind of levels of experience, sot he newer player get a taste of what its like to be on the same level as the people they're playing, cuz there's nothing worse than going out on a field just thinking you're gonna get lit up by a more experienced player.....

[C4 Explosives]

one thing i think would help with new players is in open games, granted you have enough players, to separate people for the first few games, into kind of levels of experience, sot he newer player get a taste of what its like to be on the same level as the people they're playing, cuz there's nothing worse than going out on a field just thinking you're gonna get lit up by a more experienced player.....

Right on, and I know Darrin has done this in the past, and i've actually joined in on a few of them like on urban. I asked them first if they minded me joining for a few rounds and it was great fun for everyone. I think they get a big kick out of having a more experienced player in the game to give advice and up their confidence. It can go a long way for promoting the game, which, if you're a Splattag regular you should be doing right!?

[Hawk]

exactly. plus if they do it the way that you did, by having just a couple more experienced players instead of a mob of pros against a couple newbies, it actually helps them get better faster. as long as the more experienced players give advice and up their confidence, its extreemly benificial. as for the rental gun question, i agree about the better barrel idea. if you give them the 68 carbines and up the barrel, then you get the best of two worlds. not only are the guns easy to manage, but are wickedly accurate already. add a better barrel, and youve got pwnage on your hands. the newer players using rentals would be at a much smaller disadvantage when playing against experienced ones, making the game more fun for them, and thus promoting the game. the 68 carbine with a better barrel would be a perfect rental gun. easy to manage, and the newer players could have a blast.

[C4 Explosives]

You could use cosmetic ups to make a sub-standard marker appear better to an in-experienced player. They might assume the marker is better because it looks cool, but honestly nothing forces you to get better at your game than feeling out-gunned, you find ways, oustide your gear, to win the game. Tippmann had a really good thing going with their single body reciever markers and I think they lost a lot of their quality switching over to clamshell designs like the A5 and the X7. I guess if I knew what I know now when I was a newbie I would never have screwed around with more modern markers, it's all about how you play, now what you roll with.

A lot of people look at pumps as a backballer marker, or a hobbiest marker, but remember, it only takes one ball. I see what Dave's gettin' at with having newbie's rent pumps and if you could make them progress from those, to semi's, to high-ends then they could appreciate it and would probably go back to it, but unforunately newbies don't have enough game to do well with a pump in most open play against the semi's. People that can run pump well have enough game to fall back on, newbies still probably need that semi advantage.

I'm not much of a speedballer, but in that sport i'd say you gotta have the latest and greatest elecro-marker, nothing wrong there it's SPEEDball right?

[Urban Ninja]

I wish I had started out on pump :/ I think that sounds like a wonderful idea. I'm so far just a Tippmann 98 user, but I really want to find myself a pump once I get some money after the GBG. Pump sounds like amazing fun to me, and I have used a pump before. I think starting them out on pump would be awesome. During my first game, I was hardly concerned with how fast my gun was shooting, I was just pumped. And if they realize that pump's a little toughter, they might try harder to get better before buying a $1000 marker and thinking they're amazing.

[Bizzare87]

I don't open my mouth very often on here but this is something I must say keep the Tippmann 98 custom as your basic rental its more cost effective then anything and reliable. Another option would be to pick a few mid grade electros such as an Invert Mini however along with having a gun like this you need to have someone on staff who can fix it at all times and a well supplied maintenance kit. Its a rental not a personal gun it does not need to be ultra high end.

[C4 Explosives]

Right on Rotter, it is cool for a field to offer a few high end guns for those that want to try them out, especially if the field has a pro-shop. But also, you do get those bachelor parties and such where they might want to hook up with some firepower for giggles, it can't hurt, but yeah you've gotta have that staff that can maintain them.